I've noticed Mugen sword to be pretty interesting, but I was just wondering if anyone saw what I did on his sword. Wasn't it supposed to have a white handle? At the end of episode 3, when Mugen flips his sword with one hand, I saw that it was an entirely different handle. I can't be any clear on this, but did anyone notice this too?

Hmm... that's interesting. I didn't notice it in the episode, but I did notice some discrepancies on the website (www.samuraichamploo.com). If you check the character page, his sword has a white handle. If you look at the gallery page, his sword has a dark blue handle.

I think its Jin the one that flips the handle of the sword.

I'm not exactly sure who flipped the sword handle, but that handle was quite unusual though...

I immediately noticed Jin's sword when he flipped it in preparation for Mugen's attack. The handle appears to be two narrow metal bars, held in place by the "butt end" of the handle and the blade.

Haven't noticed the color differences in Mugen's - I will have to go back and watch again. Like that will be torture.

(Hello all, btw. Fabulous job thus far!)

Good luck

myself i get too preoccupied and distracted by the kickass scenes

Mugen's sword is a very great in the sense that it's kinda like a sai (i think that's how it's spelled) with the long blade in the middle .. and like beboparia said it was Jin the one who flipped his sword .. while Mugen had the same sword while charging towards Jin

But if that was Jin's sword, what about the appearances of the handle on episode 5? They appear to be regular looking swords now... Mugen and Jin do not appear to have swords that have a handle like that...but I guess it looked like that only to be disguised as a shamisen...I'm not sure...

well i noticed Jin has 2 swords .. but they both look the same .. hehehe but why would you need 2 swords ???

but i think you're right RetroSamurai .. for appearance's sake

Yeah i think its all in the shamisen . Then later he gets his regulare swords back and they look norm. I reckon Jin would make a good giutar player by the way he strummed that shamisen!

Samurai carried a long sword and a short sword.

In their training they trained with each and then both.

The katana is the long sword- the one normally associated with a samurai in the West.
I forget what the short one is called.

At any rate:
For much of the history of Japan(care to date this someone?)
The long sword was worn by only samurai,
but the short sword was more generally available.

There's a name in ep 6(no spoiler) that Jin gives his sword: "his soul".
I spent some time earlier this summer reading kendo books, and apparently, the samurai believed that their soul was their sword.

Just a interesting bit of samurai trivia.

The samurai lived and died by the sword, and the swords were generally known as the "soul of the samurai," which really isn't a spoiler, just a history lesson. But if they wanted to, most samurai gave names to their swords. As told by Vlion, the samurai carried two swords, a short and a long one. The longer one, a katana, and the shorter one, a wakizashi. Because the katana was longer, it could not be carried indoors for most of the time, so the samurai wore the wakizashi indoors only.

But I did read in a book that I found quite interesting. In the earlier days of the samurai, you didn't have to be born into the class by family name. But as the time progressed, it developed into a custom that you had to be born into a samurai family name in order to be one.

but by that time 'samurai' were so wide-spread that it was hard to distinguish which belonged to a samurai family and clan

the long sword is to fight and the short one is to cut heads off when defeating an enemy. It really looks like a joke when i'm typing it, but thats because my english isnt that good:P

Neji

Almost 100% correct; you ALWAYS took your katana wherever you went, but you USUALLY removed it from your obi(belt) when going indoors. Wearing your katana indoors was generally an insult/agressive gesture.

Also Neji, the short sword was not really used to cut heads off. In fact, that was the katana's job most of the time. Head cutting ettiquete went like this; you strike a fatal blow to your opponent, but he isn't dead(such as a slash to the guts or removal of an arm). If your opponent falls, but does not cry out or beg, basically do anything cowardly, then you cut his head off to end his misery. If he cries out in anything other than pain, you let him die slowly.

Wakizashi were meant to be used if you lost your katana or just needed an extra blade(I could provide numerous examples but I will let you use your imagination). In fact, the sport kendo has a style called nito-ryu where one normal sized bamboo sword is used with one wakisashi-sized bamboo sword.

The word "samurai" doesnt mean literally "fighter" or "higher class man" or even "swordsman". The meaning is more like "butler" or more "servant".
And to be a good servant for the boss, you had to be a skillful swordsman. thats all
but to be a samurai with privileges you had to be a member of a clan or be a samurai who serves a daimyo (the boss of a province). even a ronin (homeless samurai, not accepted by the other samurai and feared by the general public this one is more "swordsman" than servant) could be a samurai when some clans were looking for new members.

Jin represents the old-school samurai with all their traditions. so the longer sword, the "katana" is the main battle sword, the shorter one, the "wakizashi" is the support sword. (Miyamoto Musashi developed a double-sword style, he thought that the wakizashi had to be in a fight more active).
The soul of the samurai is the sword. if you lose your katana, you also have lost your soul. normally punished with seppukku (if you´re a lucky bastard ) otherwise you would be crucified or hung.
there was a rule that a samurai had to carry his sword everytime. but indoor is the katana too long so there was an exception to carry only the wakizashi ondoors. outdoors a samurai had to carry his katana.

the wakisashi was only a proof of rank for samurai, they didn't use it untill Musashi(a famous Ronin)invented the style but a ronin did no longer always really care for that rank anymore since they lost it except is the student was told by the master to be ronin for a period of time(which was possible).

I noticed that Mugen even though is sword loos special, he didn't hesitate to trade it for money(the guy looked for rarer items so he didn't sell it) and for food(the eating competition and he lost it untill the dutch gave it back).

I certainly would have taken in that sword if I were that pawn dealer. Then it must have been a special sword if it wasn't any specific brand or anything. But in certain official art, I was wondering where that extra short weapon (Dagger or Knife?) came from But for those who have yet to see episode 10:

SPOILER!









His other weapon was secretly hidden at the bottom of his sheath or saya, and he took it out to kill Ukon after losing his primary sword. All this time, I thought he had only one weapon to use!

Blue..


White..


You tell me lol

Interesting you say that..
in the 2nd picture, it shows Mugen holding two swords...?
which would be this picture..

sorry for the spam..

btw, in a bigger picture, the second swords handle is red. the one he holds in his left hand.

just for the sake of talking, the second blade Mugen is wielding is a Tanto. samurai carried a tanto for use when either grappling or when assaulted indoors.

meethos

what color is the sword in the anime? Don't go by the pictures on the samuraichamploo site

I wouldn't take the promotional artwork very seriously. Heck, in the opening credits, we have clear shots of Fuu with blue and then green eyes.

The biggest difference, canonically, between versions of Mugen's sword is the strange shot of him flipping his sword at the end of episode 3, where the handle appears to be open in the middle. Otherwise, every time I've paid attention, it has been white-handled with a red scabbard.

that was actually Jin flipping his sword .. really

I had previously asserted Mugen based on what the background was behind the character, but now see that they're in a hallway, so the background is the same in either case.

And if it's Jin, then it's an inconsistency in his sword design.

yeah might be an inconsistancy .. but someone mentioned something about him dressing up .. that's why maybe he had to take the handle off of the sword so that it wasn't to suspicious .. you know

and also i would say the hand is too white to be mugen's .. hehe don't know .. maybe i'm imagining things .. but to me jin is whiter than mugen .. oh well

I think we already reasoned on this, but it was probably because when Jin was in that disguise, he also had to change the handle to make it match the diguise, so in this case he made it look like a shamisen.

I unno, I just posted the pics.. because maybe it would help the people who were wondering about Mugen's sword.

But at least now I know where he got that extra weapon from. At first, I assume it belonged to Fuu, or it was one of those official artwork that have nothing to do with the anime at all despite what they are wearing or what weapons they have. I'm not sure what other anime I'm referring to, but there are some that do that.

It's totally Jin's sword that has the "split handle". I stepped through it frame-by-frame and you can see that the guard doesn't have the prongs like Mugen's sword does.

This is less obvious, but the shape of the blade in the flipping shot is different too. Mugen's sword has an unusual (for a a katana) two-edged design with a fuller in the middle, whereas Jin's is the traditional single edge, which is what appears to be present in the shot in question and the surrounding shots.

As for inconsistency, I don't know, but you don't see closeups of Jin's sword very often when he doesn't have his hand over it so I couldn't say if there is any other time you definitely see that it DOESN'T have a split handle.

[EDIT] I take that last comment back, I just reviwed Ep. 1 and Jin has a totally different sword than what he has at the end of Ep. 3. Not only is the handle not split, it's much longer and has a different guard. Jin either changed handles or got an entirely new sword at some point in Ep. 3, as he still has the long-handle sword at the start of that episode. It's still definitely Jin doing the flipping, though--it must be as previously hypothesized, Jin got a different sword/handle somewhere so he could hide it in the shamisen.

As a side note, Mugen's sword seems to have a white handle in every scene I noticed. Any deviations from this are errors, or due to the lighting of the scene--I noticed the "blue handle" shot in this thread is kind of dark and backlit, so it might just be shadows making it look blue.

But what about Mugen's sword? It's pretty much an odd sword to begin with. When he tried to pawn it for some money, the owner wouldn't take it because it didn't appear to have any name brand or anything like that, and a lot of japanese swords do have a name brand. But if you've read the manga, the sword looks entirely different when you look at the edge. I'm wondering how he got that sword, and whether it was japanese origin or not...

It is an odd sword (Mugen's). As I mentioned it appears to be double edged, which is odd because A: it's a curved sword, which are usually single-edged, and B: It's ancient Japan and Japenese sword tradition heavily favors single edges. It's also got that sai-like handgaurd which AFAIK isn't traditional in ANY culture for a sword. And what's that inlay on the handle?

In other words, Mugen's sword is strange and unique, both for the setting and in general. We may find out more about its history later in the story, but it may be it's just intended to reflect Mugen's strange and unique fighting style and personality.

Well, in any case, the sword sure DOES fit his style. And since he did come from Ryuu-kyu, that may play a key role as to where the got his sword. When I see it...it reminds me of a little motif or design for a chinese sword...a hybrid of sorts...something...yeah.

mugens sword looks like a Pulouar. basically.

http://www.geocities.jp/bowen_dragon/taki/touken/pulouar.htm

I don't think Mugen's sword isn't curved like that though. It's straight. More like a t'aichi sword.

http://www.weaponmasters.com/images//produ...C_2002/750L.jpg

mugens sword isnt straight.

Sometimes it is. Have you seen the alternating in the design. I've seen one concept art that looked like it was straight, but most of the time it is curved. By the way, is the sword single-edged? Or is it double? I did a little dig on the chinese sword and here is what I found that matched it a little bit. Except it wasn't curved:
Chinese Sword
Looks like Mugens Sword a bit, except the hilt and the curved edge. Maybe it's a modified weapon? Or look at this one: Another Chinese Sword

But it's straight here:

http://www.samuraichamploo.com/gallery/images/gallery02.jpg

Jin's samurai sword is on the left side of the picture and Mugen's double edged sword is on the right.

And here's another picture where it's straight:

http://www.catsuka.com/interf/icons/samuraichamploo_005.jpg

well he is soo wierd maybe he cant deside if he is right or left handed

oh wait... re reads

yea it isnt straight but it does move directions on his back...

the tip of the handle of those chinese swords that kittenbitten and retrosamurai posted look like that on mugens sword.
but the rest of the handle and the blade look like that of a Pouluar. wich is a indian/afghan sword btw.

heres another one i found on the net. it even has the sheath with a girth for wearing on the back, like mugen does.
http://www.armouries.org.uk/extsite/view.jsp?sectionId=1190

and that emblem on mugens swords hilt and sheath u can find on this kirpan's sheath, a sikh ceremony dagger
http://www.swords.pe.kr/pictures/otherdic/kirpan.htm

I don't really know as much as any of you seem to, but isn't there something called a kodachi that's like a short katana and it was often used for more of a defensive purpose since by being smaller, it was quicker. Since katanas were longer, they had further range in attacking your opponent, but range doesn't matter so much on a defensive stance... not as much as quickness. I have no clue what my basis was when I was a child, but I always dreamed about bein ga ninja with a long and short sword, on left, one right, when held forward and one backward. the katana is strabbed over the shoulder to the back and the kodach to the back of the waist. I don't know how samurai it was, but nito is two-handed style that I thought japanese used with aiuchi (simultaneous strokes) so basically you could defend and attack at the same time meaning the opponent really shoudln't attack straight on (if their one handed) or they'll get fuxored. Like most things japanese, I believe the different sword styles came from the chinese, who have a crap load more variety of swords (and all worse quality than japanese swords). Lol, but of course, as the legends go, chinese didn't believe that the quality of the sword was from the strength of the metal but how well it could conduct the user's chi (or in japanese ki). Lol, but like I said, I have about 0 basis for any of this information and it's kinda just ramblings that somehow got stuck in my head, though I don't feel wrong.
oh yeah, and mugen's sword seems to have a non japanese style to me, maybe it's kinda chinese or indian?<--- oops, you already knew this, I totally didn't realize there were 3 pages of posts and only read the first one, my bad.

You are quite true, even though you say you don't have as much experience as us... Any opinion matters really. That is what I thought, that Mugen's sword originates in a hybrid with Chinese/Japanese. It's strange though, as the sword has a detail marking like a Chinese sword, but it is curved like a katana. It has an extra concealed weapon, Tanto, at the bottom of the sheath. It looked shorter than a kodachi though, kind of like a dagger or short sword? Also, his main sword appears to be double-edged...
But looking at Ukon/Shoryuu's sword in episode 10, it looked as though you needed a lot of strength or chi to handle such a weapon of Chinese origin! I'm not going to get into the whole Japanese/Chinese swordsmanship detail into here, because it's too broad of a topic to emphasize any further. Plus, adding on to Mugen's sword...I will bring up the subject of the time where he tried to pawn his sword off to that pawn dealer. The dealer 'would not' take it in... And then in the manga, it gives a little instance of Ryu-kyuu, where Mugen was born... So Mugen's sword is somewhat unique it its own way, no special brand, and then some... Okay, going off topic here, could it be that Mugen isn't Japanese at all? Well, that's enough for me.

I think the Ryuukyuu islands/Okinawa have always had more of a Chinese influence than the rest of Japan. You can see it in the architecture and traditional clothing. I've heard that even today, they consider themselves Okinawans rather than Japanese.

Really? That is pretty interesting. With the remaining episodes, nearly everything should be wrapped up... Though I was looking forward to seeing some more background on Mugen's past in 13-14. Was Okinawa really that 'bad' of a place to live in at the time?

I don't think it was a "bad" place. I think it was just his particular island that was used to exile criminals. The Ryuukyuu Islands are a whole chain of islands, so I guess it's not terribly surprising that they would use one for a prison.

basically its a chinese nihonto. meaning japanese katana. it is a hybrid. Reason for no brand is because this swords are ancient and old school. Also thing about chi with mugen maybe he is mixed? also sai influenced pommel or wutever tsuba is like over exaggeration of the edges on the chinese swords. as on the lings above. like how dragons and etc have long things sticking out of them in japanese culture. ive seen a picture of a dragon at a blacksmith shop with water like that. etc etc.

It kind of reminds me of Enishi's sword on Rurouni Kenshin, where it is a Japanese-influenced Chinese sword.

i thought enishi from rurouni kenshin had a chinese sword altogether O.O

Heeey guys, I'm new here ^___^

Anyway, I'll add my two cents here.

First of all, Mugen's sword is definetly unique. However I happen to own a taichi sword my self, and the handle of it is nearly identical to Mugen's sword. Of course, the blade is not curved though.

Mugen's sword is probably a katana with a chinese handle plus an odd handguard.

Anyway, someone said something about the chinese sword that the Ryu guy in episode 10 weilded... that's a Chinese broadsword, I've seen it used a lot in demonstrations where I live, and it is actually not that hard to carry or swing around if you practice a bit with it.

Not really, if you look at how it was Japanese-influenced, the blade is made in the traditional Japanese curve and such, while the handle and the way the sword is used is Chinese.